Mounted a heatsink under the distributor |
Post Reply | Page 12> |
Author | |||||
ARTIC-1
Senior Member Joined: 14 October 2009 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 434 |
Post Options
Quote Reply
Topic: Mounted a heatsink under the distributor Posted: 26 November 2009 at 7:54pm |
||||
Wow ive looked at most of this thread an have come to the conclusion
that theres a prob with HEAT in the ignition module pick up.a lot of good ideas here,an technical analysis! trobbl is i understand all of it. the good Capt Fiero had the right idea with moveing it to a differnt local where theres not as much heat.an Patrick an Dawg with mounting a heat sink under is a quick inexpensive way to do it to.myself iam going to use a vary unique remote sodium heat sink from a computer,no power required.it uses Thermal conductivity to move the heat away an if you add induction in there,mount it closer to the Exhost,it will pull heat from the cooler point,ignition module.in theory this should work,has yet to be tested? W/m-k. m2/s. |
|||||
SNOW MAN
87-GT/AUTO-2.8_ WHITE 88-TTop/ Duke-2.5. RED |
|||||
Patrick
Newbie Joined: 19 April 2008 Location: Vancouver Status: Offline Points: 5 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 26 November 2009 at 10:33am | ||||
Of course, it's all speculation and conjecture, but it makes for interesting discussion nevertheless. Thanks Chay!
|
|||||
CFoss
Senior Member Joined: 13 February 2007 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 580 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 26 November 2009 at 10:19am | ||||
It's all speculation, like you said. But when I engineer something I look at the best and worst case scenario...say the car overheats...then where does your cooling scheme go...I'd hate to overheat AND lose the ig module in 1 go! I really don't think the ambient around the dist base is that hot. The reason is that air moves. When it heats up it convects, lowering the temp again, and so on. It's not really captive in there, it's sorta captive. The heat transfer from the ex man. is radiant, not convective, so if we radiant shielded the ex manifold (Ie: a piece of sheet metal) on the dist side, then added the heat sink, the solution is pretty good.
Chay |
|||||
86 SE 3.4
|
|||||
Patrick
Newbie Joined: 19 April 2008 Location: Vancouver Status: Offline Points: 5 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 November 2009 at 11:16pm | ||||
I'm getting too old for challenges. I want immediate gratification!
|
|||||
Patrick
Newbie Joined: 19 April 2008 Location: Vancouver Status: Offline Points: 5 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 November 2009 at 10:16pm | ||||
Chay, keep in mind I pulled that number out of the air, or should I say water? Coolant returning from the radiator is probably well below that temperature. Maybe it's 150F or so.
Geez, I dunno about that. Do you really think the air temperature around the base of the distributor is less than say... 150F on a hot summer day after the engine has been brought up to temperature while running a 195F thermostat? No doubt you know a hundred (maybe a thousand?) times more about electronics than me, but I'm not so sure my question below was completely off the mark.
What would be interesting to find out though, is just what the temperature at the base of the distributor stabilizes at while the car is being driven. If that temperature is consistantly lower than whatever the temperature is of the returning coolant, then yes, I'd agree that having the ignition module cooled by engine coolant would be completely impractical.
|
|||||
CFoss
Senior Member Joined: 13 February 2007 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 580 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 November 2009 at 10:00pm | ||||
Patrick, the water idea doesn't work because the ambient becomes the 200f water. The normal air ambient/dist base has to be way less than that.
It's analagous to a dc electric circuit, where the 'common' is the ambient temp, the 'positive' is the transistor junction temp, the current is the powerflow and there are thermal impedances, which resemble resistors. A good description on the electronics analogy: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_resistance_in_electroni cs If you research it, junction temps are considered very high (unreliable, no kidding) at the 200 deg mark. Chay |
|||||
86 SE 3.4
|
|||||
Matt
Senior Member Joined: 09 February 2008 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 448 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 November 2009 at 9:40pm | ||||
Tones of fun! Don't you like a challenge? |
|||||
I wanna go fast.
|
|||||
Patrick
Newbie Joined: 19 April 2008 Location: Vancouver Status: Offline Points: 5 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 November 2009 at 7:13pm | ||||
Ummm, you want it to read like this... "Shouldn't keeping ANY of the electrical circuits in the car cooler produce more power?" Let's get this straight... You want to be packing electrical circuits around in your car cooler to produce more power? Tristan, are the drugs there more potent than here in BC or what?
|
|||||
Patrick
Newbie Joined: 19 April 2008 Location: Vancouver Status: Offline Points: 5 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 November 2009 at 7:03pm | ||||
Matt is your "hero" because the women he meets are "cold"? Geez, how much fun can they be?
|
|||||
Romeo
Senior Post God Joined: 16 November 2008 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 3033 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 November 2009 at 5:06pm | ||||
Oops, after car, there should be the word "cooler".
And Matt, you're my hero. lol |
|||||
Never shift into reverse without a back-up plan.
|
|||||
Matt
Senior Member Joined: 09 February 2008 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 448 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 November 2009 at 1:15pm | ||||
Hmmm maybe that's why I find those females "superconductive." |
|||||
I wanna go fast.
|
|||||
Patrick
Newbie Joined: 19 April 2008 Location: Vancouver Status: Offline Points: 5 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 November 2009 at 12:11pm | ||||
??? Was anyone suggesting we should be "keeping ANY of the electrical circuits" outside of the car?
|
|||||
Romeo
Senior Post God Joined: 16 November 2008 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 3033 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 November 2009 at 12:04pm | ||||
Shouldn't keeping ANY of the electrical circuits in the car produce more power? Remember, the key to superconductivity is cold. That's why the Large Hadron Collider can generate over 10,000,000,000eV, because they keep all the circuits close to absolute zero, making them literally more than ten times as effecient as if they simply focused exclusively on voltage.
|
|||||
Never shift into reverse without a back-up plan.
|
|||||
Romeo
Senior Post God Joined: 16 November 2008 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 3033 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 November 2009 at 12:01pm | ||||
Oh, I see what you did there... But yeah Patty, I think you've probably seen what I mean, liquid cooling systems, even very tiny ones, are often regarded as superior to heatsinks. |
|||||
Never shift into reverse without a back-up plan.
|
|||||
marcelvdgn
Senior Member Joined: 13 February 2007 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 284 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 24 November 2009 at 11:30pm | ||||
buy or scroung an old working portable 12volt coleman cooler/heater and tear it apart. Has all you need including the circuitry, heat sink and the peltier exchanger. plug it into your lighter and your good to go M
|
|||||
Marcel 86SE V6 Auto
85SE V6 Auto 85 2m4 soon to be sleeper 3.8sc 5 speed |
|||||
Dawg
Senior Member Joined: 15 August 2009 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 988 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 24 November 2009 at 10:52pm | ||||
Hmmmm....All this seems a little overboard.....:)
Oh I know....a Peltier Junction would be simple and would work. But still overkill.... Google it, you'll like it. DG |
|||||
You dream it up....I'll make it
|
|||||
Patrick
Newbie Joined: 19 April 2008 Location: Vancouver Status: Offline Points: 5 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 24 November 2009 at 9:33pm | ||||
That's so gnarley! (Sorry, Tristan and John forced me to say that.)
So Chay, how does that differ from the module sitting on the base of the distributor (with or without an added heat sink)? Wouldn't "heat soak" from the hot air under the decklid do the same thing, especially if the engine is restarted shortly after being turned off on a hot summer's day?
|
|||||
CFoss
Senior Member Joined: 13 February 2007 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 580 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 24 November 2009 at 9:07pm | ||||
Yeah, guys, the cooling water idea wouldn't work. The p-n junction of the transistors which are trying to dissipate power would have to get way hotter than the 200F starting point...poof.
Now, a nice liquid hydrogen cooled substrate...now you're talking! Dr. Fiero makes a good point...time to read up on black body radiation basics again! The transistor junction temperature is linked to the ambient through a 'thermal impedance' which takes into account all the things like junction to case, case to heat sink, heat sink to ambient impedance values. By adding the improved heat sink you've lowered the heat sink to ambient impedance. Given that we think of the air around the dist as cooler than the ignition module there should be a modest improvement in transistor junction temperature, given a constant thermal output from the module. I think it probably produces less heat at low rpm (Less switching), but not that much less. Worth a try though eh? Chay |
|||||
86 SE 3.4
|
|||||
Patrick
Newbie Joined: 19 April 2008 Location: Vancouver Status: Offline Points: 5 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 24 November 2009 at 8:27pm | ||||
We probably don't need to go to the extent of putting V8s in Fieros either, but does that stop everyone? Dave, if it hasn't already been done, someone someday will try using their car's cooling system to cool their ignition module. It's such a crazy idea it might just work!
|
|||||
Capt Fiero
Admin Group Founding Member Joined: 12 February 2007 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 4039 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 24 November 2009 at 7:33pm | ||||
I think what you guys are looking for called a "water block" its what the home water cooling CPU kits use. It has a flat metal surface for attaching to your CPU and then 2 hoses come off of it to your computers radiator and water pump. (yes some computers have radiators and water pumps) I thought about installing a kit like that in my large server tower. The main reason for home kits is not for extreme cooling, but no fans means no noise and the better water pumps are silent. So your computer is silent. I really don't think we need to go to the extent of using our cars cooling system to cool our ignition modules though. It might work and function, however with so much extra stuff needing to be added and hooked up, I honestly don't think it would be worth it in the long run.
|
|||||
Capt Fiero
88 Fiero GT 5spd V6 Eight Fifty Seven GT V8 5spd. |
|||||
Post Reply | Page 12> |
Tweet |
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |